Is Geoff Southern being shafted or throwing toys?

[danrok]

People are becoming increasingly feed up with this treadmill masquerading as work. They get little or no benefit from it and if you look at it in the cold light of day why bother? Why not just doss around and get welfare? The only other way you can get in the same position is if you are a lazy rich ****. So why is it everyone wants to get rich again?

There's no doubt that work is mostly repetitive and boring, but I think we easily take for granted what we have, thanks to the treadmill.

It's not that long a go that people worked from dawn to dusk, seven days a week, mostly just to put food on the table.  We've got it easy by comparison, but that doesn't necessarily bring happiness.  The joy that a new car, or TV, etc. brings doesn't last as long as the repayments on the loan!

[boatyboy]

You see Tetras, there is a problem, you keep on ranting on about the rich. Define rich ?

You and I are richer than many and not as rich as others and you and I never will be .

That’s life as they say. If your not happy do something about it.

To make sure I get this right I shall quote you word for word.

This work harder thing is total bullshit. People don't want to work harder. Work is a total waste of time to most so why should anyone want to work harder at it? The rewards are all wrong and need to be overhauled.

This is an interesting attitude, try telling it to Dad, who desperatly tries to earn 50 euros ( £25.20 ) a month when there is no work to be had, to provide for his wife and kids. Yes he lives a long way from here.

When he can earn on our  wages gross £250 a week, and has the opportunity to earn a lot more if he wants to work more hours, he will take it on with a smile. We know It will cost him more to live here, but everything is relative.

Now please tell him, work is a waste of time, I have an idea, of the response.

Regarding locals being out of work, I know a lot of Jersey people, but none who wish to do the manual work, in kitchens building sites and cleaning, the type of dirty jobs that we no longer want to do, although God knows why I'v done them when out of work. 

Boatyboy.

[fryertucker]

If I needed the money I would sweep the streets as my father used to say.

[fryertucker]

I find this quote interesting of yours -

"As per your example this is my exact point work is like slavery, he has to work and for rubbish wages this is no good to him or his family is it? I would ask you to ask him if he would work if he didn't need to? I believe most would answer with a resounding NO!"

If you cannot afford to feed a family then you shouldn't have one.

Why is it in Jersey that the people that can least afford to live here have big families?  Are they stupid or do they rely on the State to give hand outs to them?

Whatever happened to family planning or is that just what the wealthy do?

[Fritz]

The only,"family planning", the wealthy do is make sure their offspring marry into wealthier families.

[en830]

Try telling people you work on a building site and they will look down their noses at you.

About 10 years ago I had this happen to me. A man in a pup came up to me and started having a go, telling me he was better than me, that he earnt £40k pa (back then) and that I was inconsequential.

Oddly, he was working for Dandara, and I had just started in the finance industry, inverse snobbery I guess !

[moot]

About 10 years ago I had this happen to me. A man in a pup came up to me and started having a go, telling me he was better than me, that he earnt £40k pa (back then) and that I was inconsequential.
Oddly, he was working for Dandara, and I had just started in the finance industry, inverse snobbery I guess !

Just by saying this he showed himself to inconsequential. Some people learn nothing in life

[en830]

The thing is, he is probably still in the pub pissing it up the wall, I've moved on and yes because of my role in finance I now have a nice life style and on paper at least my assets probably exceed the £1m mark. However I started out low down the ladder, as a security guard standing on a gate at a brewery in the UK and have worked up from there by sheer hard work and some good luck. I don't get stressed out over my job and certainly don't live it outside of 9-5, and believe me it's not very often I have to work past 5pm.

Unlike JTM, sorry Fryertucker, I don't look on others in more manual jobs as being below me, I have been there. They are my equals in more ways than one.

[danrok]

About 10 years ago I had this happen to me. A man in a pup came up to me and started having a go, telling me he was better than me, that he earnt £40k pa (back then) and that I was inconsequential.

Oddly, he was working for Dandara, and I had just started in the finance industry, inverse snobbery I guess !

I know someone who would have been earning something like £40K and working for Dandara at the time.  No idea if this would be the same person, but he's now a director of another Jersey building firm, and seems to be making a stack!



But, good for him, he started out digging ditches, and saw opportunities to do well when he came to Jersey.

[fryertucker]

I have heard it all before.  Get a trade or be a jack.  You can work anywhere.

[en830]

I know someone who would have been earning something like £40K and working for Dandara at the time.  No idea if this would be the same person, but he's now a director of another Jersey building firm, and seems to be making a stack! But, good for him, he started out digging ditches, and saw opportunities to do well when he came to Jersey.

Yes good for him, but if his the same person, don't rub other peoples noses in it as it has a habit of spinning around and biting you on the arse.

Part of my point is that not everyone in the finance industry is a champagne swilling, Porsche driving suit and not everyone working on building sites is a low paid brainless moron, digging holes for a living.

[Lieve]

What I think the upset is for Geoff is that the JDA did extremely well in the elections, got a lot of coverage, Geoff was interviewed on CTV and BBC afterwards, but then he was brought down to earth with a big bumb, because the TV limelight and adulation didn't equate to how much power the JDA actually had in the States.

Absolutely, and he has every right to be upset about that ! Because it clearly shows the discrepancy between what the electorate say and how those that are supposed to represent the electorate vote within the states. Philip Ozouf lost so many votes compared to 2002, yet he is Minister of Treasury and even worse, Deputy Chief Minister. Geoff had an incredible increase in votes, yet he ends up with nothing.

I do not agree with all of Geoff's policies and when i do, I do not always agree with all of his suggested solutions. But what happened in the States last week just stinks ! That is also why I applaud the Shadow Cabinet. Whereas I always thought it was about the dumbest thing you could have (looking at what happens in the UK), I have to admit that I now see it as a good solution to offer real opposition in the States. And opposition does not necessarily mean that you oppose anything the ruling "party" proposes, just for the sake of being opposite. Opposition means you offer a counterbalance where necessary. It is by no means necessarily agreeing NOT to cooperate; opposition should be a way of scrutinizing propositions. And of course, I can already hear people say : "But isn't that what the scrutiny panels should be doing?" Of course it is. But look how much clout they have had the past three years. Many of them are happy to simply agree with the "rulers", and the ones that really meant to scrutinise and oppose if necessary, were often silenced very quickly.

[Lieve]

If you cannot afford to feed a family then you shouldn't have one.

Whatever happened to family planning or is that just what the wealthy do?

My husband and I got married and used to live in Belgium, where I am from. We have two sons, now 5 and 8. We owned our own house and I had a well-paid job as a teacher. Unfortunately, my husband, who is Jersey born did not speak Dutch fluently enough to find a job in Belgium, so we decided to come back to his birthplace. He has 17 years of experience in telecoms (both technical and sales), yet he cannot find a job here. I have two master's degrees and speak five languages, but I had the hardest time finding a job. I now have a job i really enjoy, which as such pays very well, but as unemployment of combined two years left us with a lot of debts, my income alone only brings us about halfway the month. Last Wednesday, we had exactly 2 pounds left, which I needed for my bus to get into work and back home. God knows how we're going to bridge it until my payday (which will probably only be on the 29th or the 30th as the banks are - understandably - closed for the holidays).

Yet, are you now telling me I should get rid of my children because I "cannot afford to bring them up" ? I was raised in a country that - amongst virtually all other European countries - offers people help when they are in dire straits ; a country with a social welfare system that offers people opportunities if they have the will to grab them. No such thing here in Jersey! And I can honestly say, we are both willing to work really hard, we do live extremely frugally (I dare anyone to find ways we could be even more economical). We do not dream of fortunes, we just want to make enough money to make the end of the month instead of just halfway the month.

Oh and by the way, if only rich people are allowed to have children, I can't wait for these children to do manual labour, serve in restaurants and bars, work for minimum wages in shops, etc.

[newmac]

Well said Lieve,
It is becoming clear from most of his posts the fryer is just trying to wind people up, which is quite sad really.
It reminds me of when the forum first started when the excuse for JTM winding up people was so it made them think. I just hope thats not the way the forum is going again, as in my opinion theres no place for things like that in a open forum.

[moot]

Lieve, I admire you for joining this forum and using your own name
From this and previous posts I get the impression that you are made of what it takes to survive and survive well
Let me tell you a story. I came to Jersey in 1975 with my then girlfriend with very little money. We paid a guest house in Belmont Road a week's bedsit rent while looking for employment. After three days we had no luck and with only £15 left we wondered into Woolworth ( average weekley wage was then £30 )
Somehow I manage to lose a fiver out of my pocket on the Woolworth floor
We frantically searched for it but to no avail. ( I wonder if they find it when they clear out the shop ? ) Then our luck changed. My girl friend got a job and so did I. We stayed and are still here. Raised two kids and our 30th wedding anniversary in January. Ups and downs, that's life and we had our fair share of it.
We never had much money and our oldest son was born in a bedsit in that same Belmont Road ( with shared toilets etc ) We lived with him iin one room for five months.
It did not make any difference in his success in life as he is now doing a PHD in Cambridge
Love your kids and you don't need much money