Support to raise retirement age

[danrok]

The old supply and demand scenario.  A growing population is no guarantee of property prices increasing.  It just isn't that simple.  There are many factors involved, and some of them are not predictable.   A demand for housing is not enough on its own.  Buyers have to have money, and you need a lot of buyers with a lot of money, to keep prices high.

There is a massive demand for houses in the UK, yet prices are tumbling.

You're suggesting the same cycles we've seen in the past will just keep repeating themselves, over and over.  Show me where that has been the case over the last 2000 years?  The world has never worked that way,  nor is it ever likely to.

Times change, they always have and always will.

Even now we are seeing signs of significant change in Jersey, e.g. a shared equity scheme for first time buyers.  Never have we seen that before in Jersey.  Even our banking friends are struggling to raise the cash for a house!  What does that tell us?

The UK tax payer Gordon Brown is buying a stake in the major banks.   That looks like a very worrying sign to Jersey banks, given his dislike of off-shore banking.  I wonder how many employees of RBS Jersey will be pleased to know that Brown is effectively to become one of their Cheifs?

If there are no banks in Jersey, in 10 years time, houses will plumet in value and stay there.

Anyone up for taking bets on this one, we could start-short selling on Jersey houses? 

[boatyboy]

You are forgetting about the two laws which would attract the middle rich to purchase everyhouse and flat on Jersey in two months if quallies were dropped,

Jersey is holding two ace cards.

I was generally indicating the English housing market. It seems outside investors are sold on Jersey, this keeps prices going up, plus a shortage of land.

Boatyboy

[danrok]

In the absence of banks,  I can't see that wealthy middle-class people would be queuing up to live here.  Where would they work?

Why would they choose here instead of one of the other 101 places they could move to?

Whilst living in the UK, I didn't meet one person who expressed a desire to live here.

[boatyboy]

Another little snippet regarding quality of life for the older islanders. JEP again but this has been discussed  on PJ

PLANS to raise the retirement age from 65 and require everyone to work longer are being discussed by ministers behind closed doors.

Draft papers circulating among States Members show that the thrust of the new Strategic Plan will be to cut back on spending, deal with an ageing society and ‘manage the expectations of the public’.

It is expected that if nothing is done, the States will be running at a £140m annual deficit by 2035, as more and more people retire and stop paying taxes, while needing more and more from social services, particularly in health spending and pensions.

Documents were distributed yesterday afternoon giving all Members an update on the ‘workshops’ held to knock initial plans into shape, but noting that it was important that it be ‘treated in confidence’.

ttp://www.thisisjersey.com/2009/01/28/retirement-age-may-have-to-be-increased/

Pensions
This item is about final salary pension funds, as operated by the States of Jersey.

Pension contributions are added to a fund that is then deposited and used to attract interest from financial institutions. We are all aware how badly the stock market and banks are doing which will have a negative effect upon all pension schemes.

Over to the Daily Mail Oct.9th 2008 extracts from page 9. Quote
By Edward Heathcote Amory …(brackets my words )

More worrying for the economy, however, is that if company (Government)
pension liabilities become to large, they will undermine otherwise healthy firms ( needing to tax more to keep them afloat)

http://planetjersey.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,342.msg16499.html#msg16499

The whole problem for the world not just Jersey, Sorry if you have read it before,

An interesting topic retirement, because it will affect all working people. I met a very pleasant Government top civil servant on a train and we discussed the subject. He told me that the Government was fully aware that the accepted system being younger people need to work in order to pay social security and their taxes to keep the old, is a load of outdated rubbish. A fundamentally flawed system, as he put it.

http://planetjersey.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,342.msg6984.html#msg6984

Boatyboy

[boatyboy]

JEP.

BUSINESSES should allow staff to work past retirement age to reduce the Island’s reliance on immigrant labour, says Chief Minister Terry Le Sueur.

http://www.thisisjersey.com/2010/01/16/let-staff-work-past-age-of-65-says-chief-minister/

This is a positive statement from Senator T. Le Suer. Does this mean though, that three early retiring department sections, the States Police, Fire and ambulance will rather than leaving (not retiring)  at 55 shall be given lighter desk or supervisory work in the same department, rather than go and get work as runner or receptionists for finance houses and lawyers officers. Obviously they are fit and able, also they take work from those, who do not get a good States pension.

Does this mean also with 1,089 approx. out of work, importing 250 people plus families a year is now a bad idea, and scrapped ? How times change when the money flow slows !

The problem of an ageing population is serious one. It is still a taboo subject involving population control, which is a direct cousin of climate control and needs  objective debate and outing as a major problem to be solved.

Senator Terry Le Suer was against free nursery places for all parents, but was outvoted.

It's good to hear some good news from the CM. Credit where it is due.


This may interest you, from an older thread and debate, is found here,


http://planetjersey.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=342.msg6984#msg6984

Boatyboy.

[Dundee]

Agree with that BB, but not sure if I condone supporting child care, as again it would appear people thing it should be a "given" how can you have population control without birth control in the form of discouraging large families especially in the less well off.

[man in the street]

it a question for me, that i am still fit enough to carry on the manual job that i do, i may be too clapped out to do it, if your are behind a desk i see no reason why you could not still work on.

[rogueelement]

I think that le sueurs' views  are tainted by the fact that he is well past his sell by and should do us a favour and feck off !
Compulsory IQ testing in the chamber , before they are allowed to vote I say , then again that would probably do away with 80% of the useless feckers, but i can,t help thinking southern and the Pitmans ,first in the queue.

[Chevalier Blanc]

Well if the Pitman's are thick it cannot be all bad with a household budget of £84,000 per year. Bank one salary and live of the other or just live on say £25,000 and save £59,000 per year. over their term of office £59,000 x 3 = £117,000 very nice for being thick would you not say. Then ask yourself the question who are the thick ones, them or you.

[Dylan]

Such a pittance to be content with! Tch Tch!

btw who's the thick one now?

[boatyboy]

As our Treasury Minister Phillip Ozouf goes globe trotting, is any work being done following the long awaited report in the UK by Lord Hutton, regarding the so called gold plated pensions that the public sector receive, but are not affordable for most people that work outside of   Government ?

From Guernsey.

Public sector ‘slow to change pensions’

By Joel de Woolfson

FINAL salary pension schemes are generally considered unaffordable and the public sector has been slower than businesses to address the problem, the Guernsey Association of Pension Providers has said.
Chairman Stephen Ainsworth (pictured) reacted yesterday after Lord Hutton released his report announcing plans to reform the UK’s public sector pension scheme, which will see workers contribute more and work longer for a less generous pension.
But Mr Ainsworth confirmed that an average earnings scheme – suggested by Lord Hutton – would probably generate a better pension than the defined contribution schemes that the majority of private sector workers receive.
‘It is a fair statement that over recent years in the private sector – both Guernsey’s finance sector and outside – employers have been reviewing their final salary pension schemes because the costs of them have gone up very significantly and employers have decided they are unaffordable,’ he said.

 http://www.thisisguernsey.com/2011/03/12/public-sector-slow-to-change-pensions/


Final report

Lord Hutton of Furness has published his final report on public service pension provision in which he
set out his recommendations to the Government

http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/indreview_johnhutton_pensions.htm

BB

[Calimachon]

I think if you are fit and well it is fine to carry on working until 65 male or female. 

If you have a legimate reason for not being able to work efficiently then that should be accounted for.

Also if you wish to work until 65 but have a disibility which does not stop you working BUT does stops you getting from place to place there should be available a reasonable bus service that allows people with disabilities to use them efficiently.

In other words think things through and provide the best methods of allowing people to go about their daily l ives and contribute to the economy in a hassle free manner.

[Chevalier Blanc]

I always felt that men were very slow at the time that women asked for equal pension rights. Namely men retire at 65 ,women 60. The women wanted to retire at 65 same as the men. Now this is where the men were slow because they should have jumped in and asked for equal rights and to retire at 60 instead of 65.
I think the women where mad and the men stupid for both asking and not asking for the same thing.